At Dan’s Tunes, we work to bring you a comprehensive picture of the Seattle music scene, and musical artists are a big part of that. But, an album doesn’t happen in a vacuum. It takes a whole host of people to bring a musician’s vision to life. In this series, “Behind the Scene,” we’re taking a look at all of the people who are integral to the process of making music that you probably haven’t heard of before — from producers and radio DJs to vinyl cutters and photographers. Our goal is to make the series both educational and a resource for artists looking to expand their teams. Today, we’re chatting with Managing Partner and Co-Founder of BandWith Management DeVon Manier.

DeVon Manier has been in the music industry since 2002 and in the management game since 2012. He grew up in Federal Way but spent much of his time at shows in the Seattle music scene. Since relocating to Seattle, he’s managed artists like Fly Moon Royalty, Fatal Lucciauno, and, most recently, The Black Tones. His artists have opened for the likes of Nas and Wu Tang Clan. Over the pandemic, he co-founded a new management company, BandWith Management.

I sat down with Manier to talk about what managers actually do, when and why bands should hire a manager, and his tips for people looking to get into management. Below is our interview, edited for length and clarity.

How long have you been in management and how did you get started?

I had a record label in Seattle from 2002 until 2013. Around 2012 is when I really started to get into management. We pretty much turned the record label into a management company. We changed it from Sportn’ Life Records to Sportn’ Life Music Group. Our biggest act at the time was Fly Moon Royalty.

I realized I was spending all my money with the record label, and as a manager I could actually make money. A record label is just a money suck at the end of the day. You’re printing a physical product, and you have a large roster of artists. But I looked at it as my education into the music business. That was my college tuition, so to speak.

I decided to close down Sportn’ Life because that was my entrance into all this. After so many years I wanted to wipe the slate clean and start new. I grabbed a couple partners during the pandemic — Janine Chiorazzi, who used to manage the True Loves, and Jake Uitti, who works with Warren Dunes — and we decided to go ahead and give it a try. 

What services do you provide? 

The manager will do all the jobs until we fill the positions. They’re your booking agent, your publicist. They’re whatever you need them to be until we’re big enough to afford to fill those positions. Some clients need work with every single thing, some need consulting and someone to handle the day-to-day business, and some need to be told, “Hey, this is the path you need to take.” The job of the manager is to get to know the client and see what holes need to be filled. 

Most importantly, though, [the manager’s role is] to turn the band into a business. Get them a formation as an LLC or whatever entity they want to be. I’ll handle most of that, but they have to understand what their merch is doing, what kind of income they make every year, and how they can make more by reaching more people.

When should bands hire a manager?

When they’re starting to pack certain rooms in town and they want to know what’s next. Not every band is made for the actual business. When you see a band is serious and they’re actually trying to make moves: They’re trying to tour, they’re trying to work with a publicist, and they’re grasping what’s beyond playing with friends on a Tuesday night or oversaturating themselves with bills locally. Each band is different, but when they’ve hit a plateau in town you can be like, “Okay, they need help.”

Or if they need help with the day to day monotony. If you’re a rising band, your email inbox is probably getting blown up every day. I’ll sift through those and only present the band with good offers.

What does a good manager do?

Help the band draw the path they want to go. Listen to the band, their goals, what it is they’d like to do, and how they like to present themselves. Work to help their vision come to life.  Stay on top of technology. [Since the time I had my record label], we went from selling physical products, to free downloads, to streaming, to social media platforms, to NFTs. It just keeps moving. Make sure your client is up to date and testing out these things. Not everything’s going to work for every artist, but you test stuff out and see. If your fans like this platform, start using it. 

Being able to see the future is also important. Sometimes I’m a year to a year-and-a-half ahead of [my clients] in my thinking because I have to have something waiting for them when they get there. If I were just here with them all the time, I’d have nothing in the future for them. You’re building something for them when they get there.

One thing the manager can do for a band is open up revenue streams. Most bands play shows and sell a little merch, and that’s all they think about. You up their merch. You up their fees. You get them on a platform to get more shows. You build this platform for them, but you also start turning on the licensing, the publishing, more and different types of merch, sponsorships. All of a sudden a band that had two revenue streams that were very small has 10 medium-sized revenue streams coming in. You’re always trying to build that.

How long do you normally work with bands?

I like to work with bands long term. I know how many years we need to put in locally, then spread out regionally, to the country, then internationally. I like to work with a band long-term because I feel like we’ll have a bigger impact, but I’m okay with helping a band get to a certain point if there’s someone else who can do more for them. It’s about getting this band to as many people as we can. 

On a contract level, I would suggest no less than like three years just so you can really dig into things. But sometimes people leave very quickly. You realize it’s not a good fit. It’s not a personal issue between people. It’s just the working relationship. You definitely look at it each year and talk to the band or client and make sure everyone’s happy.

What should bands look for in finding a manager that works for them?

They should look for someone with a reputation. Go around town and ask about that person. Talk to some of their former clients about their relationships. A good manager isn’t going to promise you anything. They’re just going to tell you, “We can do it if we work hard together.” Contrary to what some musicians think, managers are not the answer to everything. They’re just a hard working member of the team that’s needed to grow a band. Once you start hearing promises, that’s a red flag. I can promise I’ll work hard. That’s about all I can promise you. 

And someone that has knowledge. Managers aren’t professionals at all the aspects of the music industry, but we should be well informed on every aspect. We should know about the legal side. We should know about the booking side. We should know about the merch. We should know about tours and radio promotion so we can deal with each of those people on the artist’s behalf. 

How many clients do you normally work with at once?

Two to three. If I have an assistant or an intern, maybe I’ll take on another one. A lot of it depends on what the client has going on at the moment. If your more busy clients are doing a lot, I’d probably hold off.

What do you typically charge? 

Generally it falls somewhere between 15 and 20%. It depends on how hard you’re going to have to work to get the band earning revenue if they’re not already earning revenue. You want the band to make money so the band can keep moving to make more money. All of it can be negotiated. You want both parties to feel comfortable, but for the most part it’s 15 to 20% of what a band grosses.

How do you find the bands you work with?

I find my talent organically. I had two friends telling me to go check The Black Tones out. I’d heard their name. I’d seen it on social media. Never thought about the band ever. I went to see them, was blown away, approached them, and they were into it.

What advice would you give to people who want to get into management?

Really listen to the band and understand their needs. Put their needs before what you think they need. You don’t want to start off a relationship with the band feeling like you’re trying to change them. If you do want to make some changes, that’s going to come down the road. They’ll understand more if your relationship is more solid, but you don’t want to go into something telling people what they need to do and change. There’s the business side of management, but there’s also the personal side of management. Your relationship is intimate. 

Be transparent. Don’t ever leave it to where the band is questioning things about money. Be an open book, and have open books that everyone can access. Transparency and listening are super important. You have to be an organized person or you’re in the wrong business. Have vision. Be able to see beyond what’s in front of you. Especially in today’s world with the internet, anything is possible. I’m doing things now that 16 months ago I didn’t think were even possible. Don’t be scared. Jump in. Even if you don’t know what’s going on, sometimes you have to figure it out. Ask a colleague. Fake it ‘til you make it.

But the first and foremost thing I’d say as a manager is protect your client and earn revenue for your client. Those two things are super important. In a nutshell, that’s what you do. [Protect them] from making mistakes with people in the industry. Sometimes you even have to protect them from themselves, until they understand the business side better. You’re their shield. Show them what they’re worth. Sometimes a band just accepts what offer is thrown at them. Sometimes they don’t know their worth. You’ve done research and the data, and you’re like, wait, this is what you’re worth. You just brought 600 people to a venue. You’re worth that much money.

Currently, Manier is not taking unsolicited submissions. For inquiries about the bands he currently manages, email him at devon@bandwithmanagement.com. 

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